Posts by Island Man

34

Wife is FOR SURE waking up

by cappytan in

jw
friends

well, this is a new development.

she broached the subject of ttatt tonight.

said i was right about the flood.

It seems like she's waking up but is still battling with the cult phobia of apostate information. And as another poster mentioned she might relapse into cult-mode. I don't know if you've already tried this but I think it might be helpful:

Why not watch a movie about someone who is in the grip of a cult or some other psychologically manipulative authority that uses fear of the opposition to keep the person ignorant of the truth and in continued mental enslavement to the cult or authority.

Without bringing up the subject of Watchtower, get her to see Watchtower's tactic of using anti-apostate propaganda, mirrored in some other religious cult. Planet of the apes is an example of a movie that has a parallel. The ape rulers enforced a forbidden zone where all the apes were forbidden from going because they ape rulers didn't want the apes finding relics of past human civilization which would have proved that humans, contrary to what the ape rulers were saying, were intelligent beings. This mirrors Watchtower's policy of creating a forbidden zone - apostate sites - to prevent current JWs from finding out the untruths and misdeeds of the organization that led former members to leave.

So once you get her to see other manipulative authorities in movies, using censorship and fear of dissidents to control information and maintain control of those they have mentally enslaved, that should help her to think that Watchtower has perhaps done the same to her by having her afraid of visiting apostate sites.

44

I've been asked to give a public talk (should I)

by darth frosty in

jw
friends

a friend of mine who is planing his fade, has just been made talk coordinator.

so he calls me and ask 'do i want to give a talk at his hall?

' he knows my situation and lurks on this board himself.

Island Man

Here's an idea for you to consider:

Let us help you develop the talk!

Give us the theme and the outline and let us give you ideas on how you can use the material to covertly share TTATT or cause cognitive dissonance that can help to wake up some dubs.

You have been given a wonderful opportunity to help wake up dubs in a subtle way. Use it!

LOL. I just realized I have been reading a thread that's years old!

48

If this isn't the truth, then what is our hope?

by Gigi2121 in

i'm new here but not new to researching and questioning the jw beliefs.

i have quite a story.... one that's been haunting me for awhile... but first, i'd like to hear what people have to say about this topic question, please.. -gigi.

Island Man

The truth is, no one has the whole truth.

The truth is, we may never know the whole truth.

The truth is, we don't have to know the whole truth.

The truth is, the universe does not owe you the truth.

The truth is, we are alive and can enjoy life without knowing the whole truth.

The truth is, those who claim to have the truth are often very narcissistic and manipulative.

The truth is, this idea that you have to know the truth, is nothing but a manufactured need, manufactured by charlatans and manipulators.

The truth is, this idea that you have to know the truth, is exactly the kind of lure that charlatans use to entrap you in their religious cults.

13

Demon Watchtower Subliminal Images

by artcritic in

its a long time since i posted here.

time is hard to get to do the things you would like.

some of you may be wondering if the watchtower are still placing demonic images in their publications here is a link judge for yourselves.

Island Man

The whole Watchtower subliminal images conspiracy is mostly rubbish if you ask me. I think your time will be better spent reading up on pareidolia than looking for supposed subliminal images in Watchtower literature.

36

Talking to support and contacts at WT HQ

by Juan Viejo2 in

i have a story to share about my calls to wt ny hq this past week.

i was quite surprised by the level of disinterest and lack of concern from the two contacts that i spoke to.

rather than jumping right in and sharing my experience - and perhaps "poisoning the well," i'd like to read experiences of others on this forum who had the urge or need to call the wt contact number.. btw - mine was not an apostate rant or overly critical of the wt and was presented in a friendly and helpful way.

Island Man

marked

18

Has anyone heard any Watchtower PR spin or censorship advisory announcement at the kingdom hall regarding the child abuse story on NPR?

by Island Man in

i remember some years ago when barbara did an expose of the child abuse issue on one of the networks, watchtower used the elders to inform the congregations not to view the program that was to be aired.

.

after this recent expose on npr, has there been any official watchtower release read as an announcement at the kingdom hall?.

Island Man

"The good things is that the broadcast has been picked up by other newspapers as well. Unfortunately only in the US, not in Europe."

You X-JWs in the US, please do not underestimate the reach of the US media. In my country - and I'm sure in many English-speaking third world countries - much of the programming on television comes from the US - the majority of the programming in many cases! Cable-TV is also widely available in many such countries and it is not just the upper and middle class homes that have cable. PBS is one of the cable channels available in my country in the Caribbean where many relatively poor people (by US standards) have cable in their homes! Here in my country we are very, very familiar with American culture because it's practically all we are exposed to on television! So do not think for a minute that many people outside the US haven't seen that PBS program. Futhermore, I will venture to say that JWs fall into the kind of demographic that is most likely to look at PBS! JWs typically complain about there not being good programs on TV except for violence and sexual immorality. They are most likely to look at documentaries and news programs - channels like PBS.

55

Are we pro-shunning or against it?

by Simon in

just to continue my theme about religious freedom and how we approach criticizing the wts, i've also been thinking about 'shunning'.. i think shunning is the most unifying complaint that most ex-members of religious groups that practice it have in common.

it is the layer that runs under every other complaint - whatever the reason for leaving it seems "... and i was shunned" can be added to it as the final rap on the charge sheet.. of course it seems like a no-brainer to many of us and we hardly ever stop to really think about it - shunning is bad, the watchtower believes in shunning therefore the watchtower is bad.

they need to stop it.

Island Man

I don't think it's accurate to compare normal imprisonment with JW shunning. That simply isn't a fair and accurate comparison. As outlaw outlined there is a difference between confinement and JW shunning.

Persons confined are still able to communicate with their loved ones outside through phone calls and family visits. Also, prisoners are able to communicate with each other. By contrast JWs shunning means that the shunned cannot communicate with relatives (except in extreme circumstances of if they live in the same home) and the shunned are even told not to communicate with other shunned ones!

Clearly the social isolation that shunning brings is actually worse than the social isolation that comes with normal imprisonment. Only solitary confinement is comparable to JW shunning.

36

Do You Think President Obama Is Muslim?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i really think that he is.

not that it's a bad thing...

Island Man

"my question is not conspiracy based. He seems very pro Muslim, more than any other politician that I know of."

Unlike most Americans, Obama lived a significant part of his childhood outside America. He was born in Kenya and I believe he also lived a while in Indonesia - a predominantly Muslim country. So Obama is likely familiar with Islam and Muslim people having lived among them for some time. I think this explains his apparent sympathy toward and defense of, Islam. I believe he is either Atheist or he's a liberal, non-aligned theist who doesn't think God can be confined to any one religion.

18

Has anyone heard any Watchtower PR spin or censorship advisory announcement at the kingdom hall regarding the child abuse story on NPR?

by Island Man in

i remember some years ago when barbara did an expose of the child abuse issue on one of the networks, watchtower used the elders to inform the congregations not to view the program that was to be aired.

.

after this recent expose on npr, has there been any official watchtower release read as an announcement at the kingdom hall?.

Island Man

I know I said NPR in the OP but I really mean the whole spate of recent news on the JW child abuse cover up issue including what was aired on PBS.

51

CO has been coming to my door. Would like 1 or 2 solid and easy arguments.

by The Laser Viking in

i am 6th generation.

i have been out for a few years.. back story on the situation:.

i had a co come by while going door-to-door in the neighborhood.

Island Man

Another "proof" that the C.O. is likely to bring up is the house to house preaching work of JWs. 'Who else is doing that?' he may ask.

You simply tell him that there is not a single account in all the bible portraying Jesus or the apostles systematically going from house to house preaching to people at the door. All the narratives describe public preaching - the open outdoors, the marketplace, the synagogue, the temple, etc.

Interestingly, Jesus' own words at John 18:20 refutes the Watchtower suggestion that he ever went house to house preaching to people at their door.:

"Jesus answered him: “I have spoken to the world publicly. I always taught in a synagogue and in the temple, where all the Jews come together; and I spoke nothing in secret. " - John 18:20

Jesus' direction to his apostles about greeting the household had nothing to do with preaching from house to house, Jesus was schooling them on finding a suitable place of lodging in the village or city that they went in to preach publicly. This is why he tells them not to transfer from house to house - he was telling them not to abandon the hospitality of a modest home owner to go to a more comfortable house.

The showing of hospitality was a privilege in bible times and this is why Jesus told his followers that in whichever village or city they entered, search out who is deserving [of the privilege of being their hosts] and stay there (i.e. lodge there as a guest) until they leave. Jesus did the same thing when he traveled from city to city. He would always stay at the home of someone. You can point to the account of when he went to Jericho and he found Zachaeus to be deserving of the privilege of hosting him. Others in the crowed took offence at Zachaeus - a tax collector - being given this privilege. (Luke 19:1-10)

The passing reference in Acts where Paul speaks about teaching and preaching from "house to house" is likely referring to him visiting one congregation after another. He traveled from congregation to congregation all of which convened in the private houses of believers. Thus his statement of teaching from house to house is essentially another way of saying he taught from congregation to congregation.

But the Greek text actually just says "kata oikon" ("according to house") and may simply mean "in private homes". The exact same Greek expression is used at Acts 2:46 where the NWT translates it as "in private homes". So the earlier Acts reference to the apostles preaching in the temple and "from house to house" (NWT) simply means they preached in the temple and in the homes of believers - at early congregation meetings where they met for prayer and the taking of meals together. (Acts 2:46)

All christian denominations are involved in preaching but not all use the method of house to house and the bible does not mandate the specific method of house to house. So it is dishonest of Watchtower and JWs to suggest that only they are involved in the preaching work. Additionally, the bible shows that, contrary to what JWs claim, not all christians are called to the work of being a formal public evangelizer:

"And he gave some as apostles, some as prophets, some as evangelizers, some as shepherds and teachers," - Ephesians 4:11